Value-First Humans w/ George B. Thomas: Enable Value Multiplication

[00:02] **Introduction** Chris Carolan: Good morning, LinkedIn Friends, Value First Nation. Welcome to our last episode of this foundational series of Value First Humans. Here with our favorite Value First human, George B. Thomas. How are you doing, man?

[00:19] **George's Response and Closing Remarks** George B. Thomas: I'm doing good, but I think maybe you're the first favorite Value First human with all the people that you talk to, with all the content that you've done this year. Uh, Chris, we're sitting here on the the precipice of a new year. Uh, we're getting ready for the holiday season. We're literally closing this out, uh, before the new year, this, uh, kind of series that we've been doing. Um, dude, I just want to take a moment to say congratulations on 2025 and all that you've done, all that you've created, and the relationships that you've built along the way.

[01:06] **Serendipity** Chris Carolan: I appreciate that, uh, very much. And, you know, I always talk about serendipity being a wonderful thing. Uh, I can't think of a better topic to close on, uh, this year and something that can be just an explainer of why we do what we do, why I have done the work I have done in the face of like zero LinkedIn metrics telling me it's the right thing to do. George B. Thomas: Yep. Chris Carolan: Right? Um, and so this week is about enabling really valuable value multiplication any in any way, shape, or form. Uh, often in the face of of really just having faith that it's going to come back in some ways. Um, I'm not necessarily talking about religious faith, but that's how it's going to be for some people. But just that's that's what it takes to to do it at the level that that we do it, I think. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Um. Obviously, it's on a foundation of having done it, uh, for a little bit, getting tidbits here and there, uh, that we don't necessarily read into, um, to understand what's working and what's not. George B. Thomas: Yeah. George B. Thomas: I mean, listen, you can take it from the religious side of this, or you can take it from even the Gary V side of this. Like my dude has been preaching the idea of like value to reciprocity to revenue for since. Chris Carolan: I think the bigger end. George B. Thomas: Do what? Chris Carolan: Say that again? Chris Carolan: Right? Chris Carolan: Like, I'd love for you to share the the AI, uh, uh, mentioned the story about the AI mentioned to you beginning, because that's the interesting shift here, right? We're we're trying to help people not get distracted by the digital metrics anymore that aren't necessarily like telling you the truth. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Meanwhile, there's human-based signals all around you that are telling you the truth, and they're going to come like the results you're used to, it's going to come through AI. So it's like there's just this perfect storm of of of shift. And I'd love for you to share what you've been experiencing recently. George B. Thomas: Yeah, without a doubt. So, I mean, again, there's this level of understanding how the universe works, right? You add value to it. Um, based on that value, what you reap, what you sow, if you take it to the kind of faith, uh, metric that Chris was talking about, I of course take it a little bit spiritual, but I also take it just universal. Uh, Gary V again has been preaching it. But listen, ladies and gentlemen, since what, 2013, I've been creating content. I just, I fell in love with creating content. I fell in love with creating content because it was a way to add value to the world. It was a way to put a dent in the universe. The way that I've said it is that it's my way to be a catalyst for growth. Um, now, here's the fun part is when I created the content in the first place, I was probably the worst person about paying attention to SEO, search engine optimization. Am I doing this because it's a masterful SEO plan? No. When I was creating the content, was I doing it because it was this masterful building of a brand, uh, and building the George B. Thomas brand? No. Um, now, did it happen where all of a sudden the stuff that we created had SEO value? Yes, because it was valuable. Did it build a brand? Yes. Were we able to launch a business based off of the fact that we added value to the world by creating helpful content to help humans to be a catalyst for their growth and put them? Yes. Now, here's the funny thing is over the last 30 days, I've had four leads. I'm calling them leads because I don't know them, I didn't touch them, I didn't chase them. I did I they just showed up at my doorstep, okay? Humans. Four humans, but they sounded really different than any other humans that I had encountered before. Usually, I would hear things like, yeah, I heard you on your podcast or I read your article. I saw you on YouTube. I I've heard those things. This time in the last 30 days, we've had four humans show up at the doorstep, and they've said, yes, chat GPT, perplexity, Claude, like I was searching this thing or having this conversation and they mentioned you. Uh, one guy said, mentioned you and said everybody else sucks. I said, whoa, whoa, that's probably not the truth. But but at the end of the day, these conversations are are just different and they're coming from a different direction. And Chris, here was the funny thing is yesterday when I was talking to this gentleman, he said, by the way, he goes, um, are you paying for that? And I said, no, I'm not. And let me explain and it actually gave me an opportunity to explain to him the power of adding value to the world and creating content and that's how we're actually being found. And so I want everybody to realize while we're helping our clients with AEO and GEO strategies, and while we're paying attention to things like schema, and and while we're looking for the day when there's like probably another TXT file that's like AI related that is like, hey, that's a mandatory thing you should do. Not not quite yet. All of that's cool, but dang gone it, can we just go back to the fact if you're adding value to the world, if you're creating content, textual, audio, and video content and you're doing it in a human way, these dang robots realize what good humans doing good things look like and it and early days, I feel like I'm proving the fact of what I've been doing for the last 10, 12, 14 years is going to work for the next, well, until we don't need content anymore. Anyway, but I'll stop there. I'll stop there, Chris. It's just crazy how I haven't been paying for it. Um, we haven't really changed our strategy, but yet we're we're winning in this new age.

[13:45] **Pay to Play** Chris Carolan: Right. And and a a big part of this series in Value First in general is like, look folks, the pay-to-play games, the tricks, the hacks to get seen, like all of that is going by the wayside, um, because it's it's unnatural and we're going to we're going to get into that. Um, but before we go off on too many tangents, I'm going to hit this, uh, seventh commitment. Um, and and last week we talked about, you know, recognizing signals rather than manufacturing leads. Uh, you said something that I think was the perfect setup for today and really how I think you've been found in in the AIs, uh, in our AI buddies, uh, you don't have to start with a conversion to get a customer. Right? And that's the shift right there. Um, and what we want to help with today is like once the value is flowing, like once you get that good feedback, like what do you do? There's there's a couple of avenues you can go down and we're going to talk about them today. Um, but let's talk about this this commitment. Uh, we will enable multiplying value rather than extracting diminishing returns. And remember that extraction of diminishing returns part as we start talking about pay to play a little bit. Um, we believe value grows and multiplies when freely shared between people and organizations. We commit to creating environments where value can flow in all directions, generating expanding rather than diminishing returns. This means we will design offerings that create value for all participants rather than extracting maximum value from each interaction. We will enable customers to multiply the value they receive by sharing with others rather than protecting our competitive advantage. We will create community spaces where value can flow between customers rather than controlling all relationship touch points. We will focus on expanding the total value created rather than capturing more of fixed value. And we will measure success by how widely value flows rather than how efficiently we can extract and convert it. What comes to mind, George?

[16:41] **Get Out of Your Own Way** George B. Thomas: Uh. I mean, it's funny, the first thing that comes to mind is the, I've had several humans in in my life where these words, and of course these words out of love, um, have been said, uh, just get out of your own way. Get out of your own way. Like let it flow, right? And I and I love this idea of of water. I love this idea of flow. I love this idea of being in the in a state, uh, that you that you want to be in or should be in to again, get what I feel is this cycle of life. And I I promise you, I'm not trying to have this like deep philosophical conversation because this while this is usually, you know, boxed off for like life, this these same things hold true in business. And the the thing is though that we we have been taught and told a way, and we've seen, uh, that way work, and we continue to do those things based on what we were taught and told and then what we saw that works. But just because it worked once doesn't mean it always works. And yes, maybe it works if you do it to 10,000 people and five people say yes, but what if you changed and you were able to talk to 100 people and 95 said yes? Like, and we're bad at that. We're just really, as humans, we're really bad at that. And I can tell you right now more than ever, we are in a uh a place, a time, a moment where people, I'm telling you, they need to get out of their own way. They need to start to pay attention to the flow. They need to realize that everything has changed. The things that were taught in the industrial age with your hands are ladies and gentlemen, the things that you thought the internet age and the information and that was the value, I'm telling you, we're moving into a place where it's going to be more about you the human and the value that you provide and the energy of the things that you build and what it puts into the world to the reciprocity to the revenue that comes back to you. I feel like I'm preaching and I don't mean to be that way, but like, it's just really important to understand what we've been talking about through this series and not just to be like, oh, that's nice. We watched that thing, but it's like, oh, huh. So so what actions are we going to take over the next 365 days in 2026? because hmm. Chris Carolan: Yeah. And if we can like break it down, because at the end of the day, like it's this industrial age reflex that we're trying to like help you remove or rehabilitate from. However you want to put it, right? And here's some examples of what that looks like. When something valuable emerges, right? So someone engages deeply with content. Oh, let's gate, let's gate it, right? We're going to be it's highly valuable. We're going to be able to get some some people signing up for that. A referral comes in. Oh, let's create a referral program with incentives that nobody asked for. Uh, a customer succeeds. Oh, we got we got to turn that into a case study so we can so we can leverage it and and get more customers. Uh, if somebody inside the org creates knowledge or or valid, protect it as intellectual property. Uh, when a community starts forming, how do we monetize access? Right? Every one of these Yeah. treats value as something to capture rather than enable. And this is again, if you can zoom out and understand what's happening with AI, scarcity versus abundance, right? The underlying belief of of those that list of things is value is finite. If I give it away, I have less. If someone else gets value, that's value I'm not getting. And the reality is that value multiplies. Like through sharing, the more it flows, the more there is. George B. Thomas: Yeah. It it one of the things that I'm so grateful for, Chris, is that I I literally had the the four and a half almost five years that I had with Marcus Sheridan. That was like a real pivotal time in my life of like who I'm showing up as now and the and some things that I think about. Because when I hear you talk, I I giggle inside a little bit, um, not like a child, but just kind of like, huh, like, you know, that kind of giggle that you have. And it's and it's like, we've been saying since 2013, there's no secret sauce. There's no freaking secret sauce. Like the things that you know, put it out there. Um, it'll it will attract, you know, everybody's heard the story of like the Geek Squad, right? And like just do do the thing. A and like there are still organizations out there though that are living like they have the secret sauce. Like not everybody else can the secret sauce is in perplexity. The secret sauce is in chat GPT. The secret sauce is in Claude and Gemini and what like there's ladies and gentlemen, there's no secret sauce. So like if you don't tell your story, if you don't add your value, then you're you're basically, what's what's the saying um, uh, your nose despite your face or something? like like it just makes no sense. Chris Carolan: Yeah. George B. Thomas: It it makes no sense to me. Chris, one of the things that I did with this episode that I haven't historically done with the other episodes we did, but I was just in a real strange kind of mood when I was going over the uh document and thinking about this episode, I literally asked the question to my assistant. I said, what are some of the uncomfortable truths that need to be heard, right? Because I feel like this is one of those episodes where we could come off real nice and like Kumbaya, um, and it and I feel like it needs to almost be one of those like uh wraps where it's like, dang. Why they hit me in the forehead with a 2x4 on that episode. But like some of the uncomfortable truths that uh it spit out around this are you're not value first if your first move is to trap people in a funnel the moment they show interest. That's extraction wearing a nice outfit. If you only believe in giving when you can measure the payback, you do not believe in giving, you believe in control. Most gating is fear. Fear is scarcity. Fear that your work is not good enough to spread on its own. Fear that uh people do not pay, you lose. How is your winning or losing based on payment? anyway, anyway, a lot of best practices in marketing and sales are just industrial age habits. They treat humans like units and treat trust like line items. And I have to ask you if that's your organization right now.

[26:52] **Treating Trust like Line Items** Chris Carolan: Oh, man. Yeah, that trust like line items part. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Um, I mean, the first time that I can remember this kind of resonating in terms of like, what? Why would we, what? Why would we do that? Why would we get in the way of that? content is when it comes to um, gating like product information, right? Like brochures. And there's always these excuses like, oh, we got to make sure we get their state and their and their region so we can get it to the right sales rep and that's why the like literally people want to learn about your offering and you're making you're not giving it to them, right? George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Um, and in that same vein, it it wasn't that far away from when it came to social. And oh, well, we can't, we can't just put this stuff out there then our competitors are going to see it. When in reality, we're at the show. We go take our product to the show, our new launch product that's got to be secret, but we got to see what the feedback is. 100 people come to the table. Five of them are competitors and I can't say anything about it before or after the show. Guess who owns the narrative after that show. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: The five competitors because I can't say anything to the 95, right? I can't like it just no. Like you say, that the secret sauce is is out there. It's always been out there. Like you're never protecting price. That was never real. Everybody knows what everybody else's price is. And just like the need to this is the difference between like you cannot it's very hard to multiply the value if you're busy trying to extract it, right? Because extraction means we are in control. We've got to measure it. And surprise, Google ads going down, SEO going down, paid ads everywhere going down, LinkedIn metrics nobody trusts, nobody has trusted, algorithms we would love to crack, but never will be able to because now they're AI brains and they're not algorithms and they're going to do it better than we could ever imagine. So when in the face of all that in face of numbers like ad impressions as an industry, uh, intent data being 30% correct, right? Like let it go, folks. Like what are you even hanging on to anymore? right? So when George gets that response like, are you paying for this? Like I want to strike at that. Like what causes that question, George?

[30:48] **Are You Paying for That?** George B. Thomas: I think because to me, when I heard that question, it was coming from maybe one of two, maybe three. I'll give myself some open room. But one of one of two or three places. One, hey, are you paying for that? And I would say, yes, I'm using XYZ tool to which the person on the phone would write down in their little notepad, purchase XYZ tool. It's working for George B. Thomas. That's one place, right? Like how do I figure out how this cat is doing this because I find value in the fact that I found value from this guy in this place and I want to do the same. Um, rewind that and listen to that two or three times. I don't even know how I made it through that part. Like that so that's one piece. The other part too is just this idea of like there's got to be something special. Like what am I missing? Like I'm not there. How is he here? Like, you know what I mean? So it's the gap of like understanding um, I go back to my question I like to ask Chris, like from the place of is it possible? Like is it possible that this dude just is that good that he shows up in these places and doesn't actually have to do something crazy or pay for something like like, you know what I mean? Like the I feel like there's probably this branch in the brain and I don't know that human enough yet, although I'm sure that we're going to be starting a relationship in 2026 and I'll get to know that human and be able to figure out where uh that came from. Let me hit the brakes. By the way, how many of you watching this even think about that? Like I know I'm going to circle back around and try to figure out the human and why that question was asked because if I can figure out why that question was asked, I can unpack actually the way that I might answer that question for a future human that asked me the same thing in a way that unlocks their brain to a place that I need them to get to, right? So like and again, I talked about this earlier on episodes like we're in a place in time where surface level is no longer any good and if closed one is where you stop, you're dead. Like closed one is not where I stop. Closed one is the beginning of my race with a human. Like. Chris Carolan: That's why we stopped calling it close one uh in value first uh terms. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Yeah, we call that activation. George B. Thomas: Yes. Chris Carolan: Folks. George B. Thomas: Yes. Chris Carolan: And appreciate Rob Jones today, uh, showing up. Yes, he is that good. George B. Thomas: Oh hot dog, come on now, come on. Chris Carolan: But but hang on because I got to say this like all all of this that I'm saying on these episodes, please understand that I'm saying this as like humbly. Because I never show up at my keyboard, show up at the mic, or show up in front of the camera and be like, I'm the shit. Uh, I I show up and like, um, okay, I'm the, uh, sensei who needs to show up as the master and then just kind of go back to being the sensei so that I can add value to like there might be people like one step below me that might get value. There might people people like 20 steps below me and I don't mean in like any type of like weird way that will get value. But I realize there's a billion thousand people that are like make me look like the dumbest dude on planet Earth. I and if you can't have that reality of like who you are and where you fit into your space or spaces. And so like when when when I say, is he that good? I I am not saying that from a like egotistical bragadocious place. I'm just saying, simple stuff works. I'm a simple guy that uses simple words that creates simple content that helps people. Like I'm not a ninja. I'm not a Gary V. I'm not a Neil Patel. I'm not a Marcus Sheridan. I'm just George B. Thomas. I'm out here doing my thing. And guess what? My thing happens to work a little bit.

[36:55] **What do you do With This?** Chris Carolan: Yeah. And yeah, a little bit of underselling yourself there, but I don't know if I know anybody that creates as much as one George B. Thomas. George B. Thomas: You you do. You you make me look like I don't even create content. What are you talking about? Chris Carolan: Oh, man. George B. Thomas: I'm like, man, how can I be Chris Carolan when I grow up? Like the amount of humans that you talk to, have you done the math? Have you done the math the amount of humans that you talk to in 2025, the amount of episodes that you did. Like, I don't I think you're, hang on, no, no, hang on. I got to go here. Chris Carolan: That's incredible. George B. Thomas: I think you are where I was before Dan Tire told me face to face that I had built a billion dollar brand. I don't think you understand the value of who you have become an ecosystem. Okay, that's not why we're here. Let's. Chris Carolan: I am currently doing the math and uh the math I will be shared uh in in uh by the end of the year. I hope. George B. Thomas: Good. Good. Chris Carolan: Um, but um, oh, yeah, so what does, since I can't remember what I was going to say, uh, what does content multiplication look like? Let's go through some example. Last week we talked about an idea. Haven't implemented it yet, but the share to AI button. Like instead of downloading like if you know somebody's like what we've seen is like the Cloud Flarers of the world and like the industrial infrastructure still there. We don't crawl my shit, blah, blah, blah. Right? You know that people are going to copy-paste, screenshot, do whatever they can to go and take it to their AI friend of choice so that they can talk to somebody about it, right? George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Because it's 2:00 a.m. on a Saturday and they're not even trying to ask a human, but there's a new friend that can now be available to have this conversation. So making it easier for people to learn through that conversation that they're going to have with AI, right? Not assuming that, oh, we've got to do it in the picture perfect way because then they're going to be here and they're going to consume and they're going to spend time on site. It's like, no, assume that everybody wants to learn in a conversational way, right? And now they have that AI conversation waiting for them wherever they, wherever they look, right? You talked about your 12 days devotional, right? No conversion, just value. Trust returns, right? Ungated resources that spread through networks and that's through through content multiplication. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Right? George B. Thomas: Dude. Can I tell you, no, just well I'll shut up. Finish, then I have another story for you. Chris Carolan: Right. So we've got three other categories in here. We got knowledge multiplication, right? Teaching frameworks openly versus protecting methodologies. Like trademarking stuff, like things that make it harder for other people to latch on and go nuts with it, right? Helping customers become independent versus maintaining dependency, training competitors, yes, really to elevate the entire field. By the way, anybody teaching inside of the HubSpot ecosystem is constantly training competitors. And guess what? We all need training because people still don't know what the hell HubSpot does at the end of the day, including AI, by the way. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Uh, relationship multiplication. Referral partners without incentive programs. Man, I'm so excited to see what people think of what's happening at Value First right now as it continues to grow in 2026. Um, because it's without incentive programs, without contracts, without sign agreements, right? And and people are freely sharing value with each other. Customers who become advocates without being asked. Community members who support each other. And not just you. And success multiplication, customer wins celebrated publicly for their benefit, but not just yours. Man, I'm going to come back to that one in a second. Uh, lessons learned shared even when they're hard. Yeah. Right? Rising tide that lifts all boats in your ecosystem. This customer win celebrated publicly. Oh, man, the testimonial and case study strategy when you try to get people to speak on your behalf. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: When you are when you have an extraction mentality, you're constantly in what's in it for me mode. George B. Thomas: Yep. Chris Carolan: And you're trying as you do that, you're asking from that perspective from people who are not prepared to do testimonials, have no idea what that looks like, probably has a legal team, whatever, it's so easy for them to just say, nope, we're good. I don't want to do any of that. But when you come at it from this other perspective, like, hey, man, you you're like leading the industry now because of the work that we did together. We would love to highlight that. Like how can we work together to highlight that? Like they decided to do business with you or or invest in your product or service because it made their business better. Why wouldn't they want to talk about that? They'll come up with a lot of excuses, but when you can present it from that perspective and then show them, here, here's what that post will look like. It's nothing about us and our business, it's about you and how you're dominating now. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Right? George B. Thomas: And it's Chris, what what I would give somebody something to just latch in their brain. Listen throughout your day to this. Tally it in a notebook if you have to. The amount of times that you say, can you versus the times that you say, can we? And with what you're talking about, hey, could you give us, could you give us a video testimonial or hey, can we share your story? Again, how do you enable them to have a an amazing presence that felt like you were investing then in them, investing in them instead of extracting from them, right? And so again, I I'm going to break it down that simple thing. Can you versus can we? And start to think about how you're using that in your life. Chris, I've got to go back to your content thing for a second because I'm really excited. Um, hey about these conversations that we've been having, uh, be about something I've been building, uh, over the last like 30 days. And um, especially over the last two days. And this is going to sound insane. Um, but if you're a content creator and I asked you, hey, could you create a resource that is 67,000 plus words in two days, you'd probably be like, no. That being said, this also had been being built out over time, at least the base pieces of it. But Chris, over the last two days, we've created the most rich, robust version of the superhuman framework ever known to man, and I did the math because you've got the overview page, you've got the four cornerstones and you've got the 10 pillars. We're over 67,000 words on 15 different pages of a website that if one was just to take the time to go and read those. But wait, there's more. Go to those pages and hit the little mini player and listen to those when they're driving down the road or flying in a plane or going on a hike, the amount of transformation or um, culture change over 15 pages of a website that an organization could have, I I can't even begin to start to measure what that might do. And there's no gate. It's it's there for free. Google, uh, I've asked it to to start to search the site. Google's probably losing its mind right now of like, what is happening over here? Because when I say it's dope, it's dope value. Like to the point where it's pseudo making me rethink things that I've already thought for years as a human, right? And so what people need to again realize is like if you've had ever dreamed about creating, producing or changing something in the universe, we have that ability through the content we create. If you create that content, it should be because you want the maximum amount of eyeballs to actually get to the content and then see what happens on the other side. I go back to that faith word we used at the beginning or the reciprocity based on the process. Chris Carolan: Yeah. And again, it's it's all mindset because if you're stuck in extraction mode or scarcity mode, you will not be able to leverage AI, in a way that is allowing like what George has described to happen right now, enabling it, right? George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Oh, man. I got some Ryan. So so so much good stuff. Ryan says, give me the George B. Thomas skill.md. George B. Thomas: So, first of all, Ryan, I love that's a great joke. Um, I don't even know if they have a skill for that. My wife would probably just tell you, we don't need another skill like that. Um, but I will tell you the skill.md, this is going to get real nerdy. If you have not been using skills in Claude or Claude code, what's a matter what you, please, take over this holiday season to just YouTube search ski Claude code and skills. Um, I have, I think it's last time I counted, 14 skills in my Claude code, um, based really like granular on the thing that I'm creating. So like there's a, uh, superhuman framework skill. There's a anyway, I I skills, ladies. By the way, here's what's funny. Um, you should be paying attention to skills in Claude code moving forward and Claude moving forward and in any assistant you use. Um, news flash, you should probably be paying attention to your skills in the future as well. Just throwing that out there. Like just saying. Chris Carolan: Yeah. Chris Carolan: Um, and this has been a recurring thread through all the content that I think we've done together. It's it's the trust. Like helping people get to this trust factor because it does, it requires trust. Um, and it's trust that value given returns, eventually somehow, right? Not in this way and by this much, right? Eventually somehow, right? And and whether you like it or not, AI is forcing you in that direction or you will not be able to leverage it, um, in the way that that you want to. Yeah. Uh, trust that customers can handle transparency. Man. Trust that competitors can't replicate your authentic approach. Like people could go on George's site and even after a while, actually no, you can already ask AI about superhuman framework and it'll, it'll give you all the details. George B. Thomas: Yeah. Chris Carolan: But they can't show up and be George B. Thomas, right? Like trust that the relationship matters more than the transaction and trust in the long game over the short squeeze. George B. Thomas: See, Chris, I love what you just said. But there's got to be an unlock that happens. Um, I in the next words that come out of my mouth, I am not trying to be promotional and I am not trying to be, let me just say it, because you got to be you, right? Um, I want to I want to choose my words wisely. So one, if you're watching this and again, it might be now live, it might be in the future as a recording, um, if you cannot show up as a whole ass human because of things that have happened or baggage that you carry, um, you need to unlock that, whether it be through therapy, whether it be through some type of journey, and again, I'm not being promotional here, but there is a a hidden gem of a podcast beyond your default.com. Just take the time to go listen to beyond your default, okay? Start with episode one and work your way through it. Um, it really was designed to help people kind of unlock things that they've historically dealt with around fear and things like that. So somehow you've got to unlock how do I in